New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

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Airtrooper
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New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Airtrooper »

I've been doing some more IRIS Vulcan flying in v4 and I'm absolutely loving it...

However, with some good flights in my v4 log book my wants are changing. I think I'm in the minority though... a subscriber to a niche, within a niche, within a niche etc. Unlike the vast majority of MS-based flight simmers airliners aren't really my thing (with the exception of classic British types, also used by the military!). I prefer:
  • Military
  • British
  • Cold War era
This immediately puts me in a small FS group, but the next three really make me feel like a minority of perhaps a few:
  • Multi-player
  • Operations as much as aviating
  • TacPack
(I haven't even mentioned my preference for FAA, AAC and helicopters yet! :worried: )

Wanting to operate such aircraft is what keeps me going back to the Flying Stations Buccaneer... I like to be the Observer operating the radar, weapons etc. just as much as being the Pilot.

Now back to the IRIS Vulcan... Lovely as she is to fly, and look at, I ache with the desire to have all crew positions modelled in full (as much as the sim will allow) and to have an operational H2S radar, bomb sight etc etc. Add TacPack and I'll be in heaven! I think for this to happen would need an all-new Vulcan built from the ground up.

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I suspect that pre-v4 the demands this might have placed on the old sim would have been too much. Now with v4 there is scope for such complex models whilst maintaining usable performance... plus P3D now supports the development of radar a la H2S...

The only problem is, would there be the demand to develop such an addon... and given the investment needed to attain the complexity involved would it make any sense, cost/benefit wise, for any developer, freeware or payware??!! I imagine some classic British simmers would raise their hand to say they'd like (and would possibly buy) a new Vulcan for v4, but how many of those would really operate her multi-player, rather than just fly her solo and oogle at her?

Please discuss....! ;)
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Filonian
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Filonian »

Have you thought about getting to grips with modelling yourself?


Graham
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Airtrooper
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Airtrooper »

Many thanks for your reply Graham :thumbsup:

Yes, indeed I have/am

I admit a slice of my reasoning in creating this thread was to gauge interest in such. I think if it were less a complex product, such as a single engine prop, I'd consider that making it myself, for myself, would be a viable proposition. However, such a complex product would need a team effort, I believe. Quite apart from the complexity/enormity of the task I also lack the all-round skills needed. I reckon my skills are at about the following levels, with 100 % being "qualified" and ready to make products:

Modelling mesh (i.e. 3D Studio Max): 70%
Animation: 10%
Materials and texturing: 45%
Gauge programming (C, XML etc): 5%
Flight model programming: 5%
Sounds and sound editing: 0%

My modelling and texturing has been good enough to contribute to development of scenery projects (i.e. Airfield Construction Group and iBlueyonder), with some of my solo scenery hopefully seeing the light of day sometime... but full-blown, full-fat SimObjects are another matter! For one thing my programming is seriously rusty and I'd need to study hard!

That doesn't stop me wanting to see a new "operational" Vulcan, whoever takes it on...
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Airtrooper
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Airtrooper »

BTW, the manual lists 6 people in the development of this non-operational (so to speak) Vulcan:

David Brice
Andrew Nott
Dean Hall
Nick Degnan
Pam Brooker
Paul Frimston

In fact this didn't even include the modelling, as the mesh was bought from the MilViz team!

Reading the manual also gives a sense of the passion, dedication and sheer effort that the team needed to complete the project. A fully "operational" Vulcan would take more.
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Airtrooper
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Airtrooper »

Oh and I forgot the small fortune and/or hours in archives spent on researching original material (Aircrew Notes, blueprints, Maintenance Manuals, cross-country visits with overnight stays to measure original aircraft inside and out in museums or private collections etc). It is tough enough doing the necessary research for airfields!

Don't get me wrong, I'd be up for the challenge, but I think this one would be too much to undertake solo...

I have nothing but admiration for those who do full-blown SimObject development. If you're reading this I take my hat off to you :cheers:
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TSR2
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by TSR2 »

I think you've hit the nail on the head to some extent, it needs to be something you're passionate about.

When I started Thurleigh, I was really curious about the airfield. I spent almost £100 on books and plans etc, not because I wanted to make an airfields, but because the more I found out about it, the more into it I became. In the end its OK, and was a really good experience. I get no more than a couple of hours a week in the sim these days, and when I started Thurleigh, I was doing 5 or 6 hours a night, learning Sketchup, compiling models, testing it in the sim and then back to SketchUp.

I really think it needs to be a topic you are either fascinated with, or become fascinated about to keep the enthusiasm going for months on end. There are lots of talented folk out there, but, IMHO, their best work is something that they are really into. I never really understood why A or B or C couldn't just knock something up. And now I do.
Ben.:tunes:

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DaveG
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by DaveG »

I can't see it ever happening. The amount of work required vs the number of sales just wouldn't make it a viable product from a payware point of view IMHO.
Like Ben has said, if you're going to spend the huge amounts of time and money on a project for little, or no return you need to be really passionate about the subject otherwise it will never get finished.
Most of the time I never fly my own stuff because by the time I've released it, I'm sick of looking at it! :lol:
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Airtrooper
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by Airtrooper »

TSR2 wrote:
10 Jul 2017, 19:39
When I started Thurleigh, I was really curious about the airfield. I spent almost £100 on books and plans etc, not because I wanted to make an airfields, but because the more I found out about it, the more into it I became.
I can totally relate to that. I first decided to make RNAS Lossiemouth on 13th (unlucky!) September 2009... and I'm STILL at it! I hate to think of how much I've spent on it, but an indication is that my last lot of research cost me in excess of £230. If I costed the time I spent writing, reading, chasing, travelling, petrol, accommodation, food and actual hours in archives/museums... well, it would be VERY costly indeed. All that just for one airfield, not even released! Like you, the more I researched the more I wanted to know, to the point the research almost took over from the end goal. I keep check on myself by keeping flying! I totally admire you for releasing Thurleigh! :thumbsup:

In short, getting back to the Vulcan, the mountain to climb would be Everest-like in comparison, but the little researcher/devil on my shoulder would sure like to summit!
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TSR2
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by TSR2 »

Don't get me wrong, I think it would be a fantastic project (the Vulcan), but while I think its a great aircraft, I'm much more of a Victor man. I love that HP were always the underling and the Victor was such a great aircraft, outliving the other 2 V-bombers by some margin.
Ben.:tunes:

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FlyTexas
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Re: New Avro Vulcan: A discussion

Post by FlyTexas »

The Avro Atlantic would be a great project. :) I'm not sure if it would appeal to the masses, though. :(
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Brian

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