A380 Lands Hard at Oshkosh

[AllanL]

More like the outpourings of the back end of a pantomime horse, or some of the crayon wielding experts on yoohoo-tube

I always thought that PIOs required more than two control input cycles, but there you go.

Garry, I do believe that two years after rollout there is still no scheduled date for first flight of the nightmareliner. It's overweight, too many super size me cheeseburgers and hanging about the hangar getting no exercise no doubt, and possibly that explains why the rivets keep popping or dropping out or whatever is causing the shortage.

The Rolls-Royce engines have been ready for two years though! Fine examples of american engineeering there.

If anyone is being defamed I would put my money on the Airbus pilots......

Talking of horse-sh*t, has anyone read the pronouncements of the USF1 team about how most F1 engineering comes from the states anyway, and that is why they are building the cars for the new team over there?

Can't think of any F1 technology that is currently sourced from the other side of the pond myself, any enlightenment out there?

[Garry Russell]

Yep Allan....I was being cheeky

Last I heard was August then supposedly a further delay of 6-8 months but that is not an official announcement.

The great thing about this forum is we can post facts about the USA in the sure knowledge we will be corrected within a few hours. ...any bets


Garry

[airboatr]

Slander Chris
Garry

well OK your one of the bosses!

Shi :roll: rley you got to be kidding me! come on!!! get yourself a new pair of glasses ..
.... you wouldn't know a PIO if it walked up and .........



comon now ... you know we're kiddin








btw ...
:think: PIO ??.... I thought that was when someone had drank too much there ... Pi$$ed In Oshkosh

[DaveB]

You know CT.. Mr Jovial ;-)

All this BLX about PIO.. is it just me or did anyone else not notice any attempt to KOD just before TD. It's always easy to be critical as camera views don't show the whole story but having watched the clip time and time again (without the sound of Itchy and Scratchy blabbing away in the background) and I can't see any rudder movement other than the slightest touch at around 100ft. Had Joe Bloggs up front not made this now infamous PIO.. the 380 would've been where the cameraman was and not on the runway

It is probably true to say that neither Itchy or Scratchy are 'au fait' with what the 380 is and is not capable of and perhaps a similar landing in a TripleSeven would have written it off Funny.. I was talking to a current (as in BA.. current pilot.. current aircraft) 777 pilot a few weeks ago who commented that he couldn't wait to get back to an Airbus again (I kid yea not) ;-)

Be lucky

ATB

DaveB :tab:

[airboatr]

Funny.. I was talking to a current (as in BA.. current pilot.. current aircraft) 777 pilot a few weeks ago who commented that he couldn't wait to get back to an Airbus again (I kid yea not) ;-)

Be lucky

ATB

DaveB :tab:

Now... Dave ... Dave

you know thats only because there is no yoke and the tea tray fits nicer.

[DaveB]

It could also be that he doesn't like the idea of landing short of the runway either No.. jesting aside, he was a nice chap.. he had his wife with him too (who's a hostie!) and he stayed with us for some time talking through the new procedure BA are using to combat the icing problem on the 777. He was quite genuine when he said he couldn't wait to get onto an Airbus again.. he just doesn't like the 777. The conversation then turned to the chances of him becoming a captain on a 380 and this is very slim indeed for the near future. It would appear that the ranks are closing and only the very senior captains (with enough time left) will enjoy such a lofty position in BA. He was only a young chap so there's time for him yet ;-)

ATB

DaveB :tab:

[airboatr]

didn't doubt ya for a minute Dave olboy,
.....but you know .... :roll: jocularity

it's one of the best halves of this site .... the ribbing

That aside...
that would have been an interesting conversation to have heard first hand, all the best to your friend.

[Chris Trott]

Sorry, been away from the computer since Friday night. The "PIO" I see is when the aircraft makes two very noticeable swerves after landing and subsiding thereafter.

However, I have more information on the situation. While I still think the landing was an "ugly" one as far as making a nice arrival for a "showcase" aircraft, it seems that the aircraft had to make the AeroShell Square turnoff from the runway, giving them about 5500 feet of usable runway. So, the crew chose to land the aircraft "firmly" and brake hard. The crosswind component didn't help and the failure to properly kick out the wind component (a problem with the Airbus-taught procedure, not the airplane) caused situation where the pilot started PIO.

And just to be clear, the information on the Airbus procedure for "kicking out" the wind is from multiple Frontier Airlines pilots who went through the Airbus class. Airbus teaches pilots to kick out the wind component at the last possible second (under 100 feet) and it's autopilot does the same when in autoland mode. The pilots I spoke with didn't like this as in the US, the idea of a "stabilized approach" is King, and to make an abrupt and firm control input on extremely short final is not a "stabilized" control movement as you have just destabilized the aircraft and must restabilize it prior to touchdown. What you saw was the Airbus crew doing exactly that - making an unstabilized arrival. They should have begun kicking out the crosswind and transitioning to a slight slip earlier in the approach (between 500 and 200 feet AGL) so they would be straight and stabilized on touchdown. The bad thing with this is that the A380 has very little ground clearance on its inboard engines (compared to the gear track and side area) so it cannot slip as it probably should be able to, but there shouldn't have been a problem looking at their final attitude on touchdown.

[AllanL]

So Dave, you're saying that KODSWLP leads to BLX - the Kick-Off Drift Sorted Windinduced Landinggearstressreduction Procedure leads to Boingcentric Linguistic eXecrations.

[DaveB]

In a roundabout way, yes.. that's it Allan

CT..
To be brutally honest.. that landing is far from the smoothest I've seen.. all here will agree and as your last post reads, that is exactly what the crew intended. I'm still a bit miffed at the apparent lack of KoD as there is footage somewhere on the web (can't remember where but someone posted here) of the 380 coming in at some pretty extreme angles (during flight trials I think) and managing to kick the angle off prior to TD. If anyone remembers the post or a link to this footage.. please repost the link ;-)

EDIT.. here's one.. there are more on YouTube.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMN26EWioss

ATB

DaveB :tab: