Nimrod MR4 - R.I.P

[NigelC]

Only one jet frame out there for the. job. Boeing P-8 Poseidon

[Trev Clark]

And there was us, a few years ago, lamenting what a 'balls up' the Nimrod AEW was! It just goes to show how poor our aviation R and D is nowadays!

Nothing said about the NG tanker fleet, so it looks like that might have escaped. I just hope they will have good trooping abilities as the C-130's are being retired 10 years early which will just leave the C-17 (overworked already) and Easyjet!

[DaveB]

Apparently one of our Trident subs was shadowed after leaving port when MR2 was retired

I doubt MR2 retirement had anything to do with that.. if it happened at all. Speaking from experience.. I never saw an MR2 (or any other Nimrod) while based up at Faslane for 12-months on HMS Wakeful. Our job was to make as much noise as possible (which was easy given that Wakeful was a deep-sea tug running twin 9-cylinder Paxman diesels) in and around the in/out routes for the previous 'nuclear deterrent' fleet but that's the game. Folk not connected with the services have a knack of underestimating what the opposition are doing or what they're capable of and 'presume' they are 'over there' when in fact.. they're also 'over here'. It's a case of.. we know.. they know.. we know they know.. and they know we know for the most part.. if that makes sense. Of course, specifics are a different matter but in the end.. specification details of the Trident missile are probably known (roughly) by most countries that want to know so it's a simple matter of knowing how far one will go then drawing a line or series of lines. You will eventually get a rough idea of a subs operating areas and try to find them in those areas.
Everyone knows how many Trident subs we have and they know where the 'off station' boats are. The story goes on.. and on but the main part of the 'game' is to not let the information be widely available. Sort of 'hide and seek' but a bit more complicated

I'm sorry the MRA4 has been scrapped.. not least of all because of the taxpayers money that's been thrown at it in government overspend over many years. As for the aircraft carriers without aircraft and the cuts mentioned in other posts.. more could be said but is it worth it.

ATB

DaveB

[DispatchDragon]

......I can see Russia stepping up and testing our now severely limited defence.

According to my nephew - who recieved the News that he will be homeless very shortly (He and his wife have lived at Kinloss for 20 odd years) whilst on detachment in the sandbox - The Russian's have been
testing the GIUK for several years -- and were actually detered by a 60year old frame from the Cold War...........so who screwed the pooch this time? contrary to popular belief by our American cousins the Nimrod
always had and still has the finest ASW suite anywhere. Which is why during the cold war -Kinloss was always targeted for a tactical first.

[Chris Trott]

I somewhat suspect that if anything is bought to replace the Nimrod, it's gonna be the Boeing P-8 / MMA as it's almost ready to start production whereas any A330 variant would require a lot of development. Otherwise, the UK may be SOL.

Also, I've not heard any US Navy ASW guy who's actually been on duty for any amount of that say anything other than the Nimrod was the best. Nimrods routinely found US SSBN's during exercises while the P-3's and S-3's wandered aimlessly. The P-3 was good at finding one thing - Russian SSN's. They did okay against their SSBN's, but only because up until the Typhoon, they were pretty loud compared to even our SSN's. The S-3's couldn't find a Russian missile boat unless it was at or near periscope depth and they got REALLY lucky. I think that's why the P-8's operational requirements bear so much similarity to the Nimrod.

[Nigel Edwards]

Replacement is unlikely to happen, and all the expertise will be lost very quickly once people get posted away....

[jonesey2k]

This is the end, my only friend, the end...

[Paul K]

I find it difficult to accept that this island nation is no longer going to have a long-range maritime patrol aircraft. We have vital energy resources out in the North Sea, shipping coming into and through our waters from all over the world, and a resurgent Russia flexing its military muscle once more. All we need is some Islamic fruitcake having a crack at the North Sea oil platforms, a cruise ship on fire in the Atlantic or Russian Navy News publishing a periscope photo of the Liver Building, and they'll rue the day they took this decision.

Okay, perhaps the Liver Building photo is a bit of an exaggeration, but we are surrounded by millions of square miles of ocean and no longer have the ability to get out there and check up on it. The time to cancel the MR4 was 10 or 15 years ago...not now, just as its about to offer a return on all the money and effort. The requirement for such an aircraft will never go away, and what will fill it ? The P8 Poseidon ? Something will have to.

[Nigel Edwards]

I couldn't agree more as do my colleagues! Shame that those in authority don't feel the same..............