Classic British Flight Sim

Jim..

The difference in drag between FS02 and FS04 was/is quite large. I spent a fortnight while DM was away camping near Llanbedr running the '02 Trident on 3 PC's, sometimes two flights per day (each) to get the fuel scalar/aircraft load within real-world parameters and felt it was there on his return. The week after the '02 model was released.. '04 was released and I tried it again and didn't even get as far as Cyprus!! :roll: Fortuantely, enough data had been accumulated to get it to run there or thereabouts in '04 with the minimum of fuss.

I never tried flapless or slatless landings in either the Trident or the VC10 but as with all things.. wait long enough and someone will turn up who does There are only so many variables you can aim for and the usual byword is 'Compromise' ;-)

ATB

DaveB :tab:

The safe speed for a clean wing on the Trident was quite high.

Wouldn't fancy driving one of those in without LE slats.

I guess though if it were light you might get away with it

Garry

HI Dave/Garry

Must admit i've not tried a clean winger on the trident yet... Something for later perhaps..!

On the VC10 front, what I find is that with gear down, a standard approach with the clean wing is a little tricky below 170 kts, and the extra drag means a lot of throttle is needed coupled with a high AOA. I (just) managed a clean touchdown at 145 kts, but had to hold at about 80% thrust over the threshold with a lunatic AOA. Wheelsdown was soft enough but I probably buckled the plane with the speed the nose came down. :think: So quite a hard procedure: do you blow out the tyres or bend the airframe....?

It would be great if FS had some sort of calculation within it that could give you a 'stress' report - it sounds like it would be easy enough to do (as everything 'sounds easy!') :tab: a few parameters for weights/speeds/limits coupled with descent rate etc, could theoretically say 'OK landing' 'Two Punctures' 'You're sacked' or whatever! It's all too easy in FS to overstress the A/C, yet at the same time it seems to let you off with other bad movements!


jim

Via FSUIPC, you should be able to get these items. I think there is a "flight test" recorder out there somewhere that may just record those items for posterity sake. Just don't go and blow up too much. :fart:

Thanks for that Tonks.

Just had a play around at EGQL and started from 7 miles out at 3000ft and 230 kts, clean wing.

I just cheated and used the spoilers to bring me in at the correct angle, VAT for the weight was 117kts on my outmoded FS02.

Landed with about 15 nose up at 134 kts, and after the wheels were all down, activated reverse, stopping in less than 500 feet from nose-down. But it would probably have been a bent plane!

Can't wait for '04 to arrive, so I can feel how this Maltby machine works properly!!!

Jim

You're going to be very disappointed with it in FS2004 if you're wanting to fly these odd scenarios.
As I said earlier, you'll only get VC10 like behaviour when doing everyday airliner stuff. Normal takeoff, climb, cruise, descent, approach & landing it will do pretty well in FS2004. Anything out of the ordinary isn't likely to give accurate behaviour.

An FS flight model is an illusion - balancing loads of numbers that we don't understand. It's never going to hit the mark on everything.

DM

HI David,

Well, to be honest the scenarios are a little bizarre, and I'd much rather have everything working as it should... ;-)

The Trident - while maybe slightly more sluggish on the controls, (in FS02)flies like it's on rails on the approach, unlike the VC (which was partly why I initiated these ludicrous handling scenarios!)

If I look at my fleet, a good proportion have some flaw (including payware) particularly in the landing phase - even at VAT + 10 my various Airbus and Boeings will suck down onto the tarmac, while others at virtually stall speed will prove impossible to land until about 50% of the runway is past.....

Mind you, it is funny, I was convinced that there was a MAJOR difference in handling between your VCs, but this isn't the case, it's more that because I'm trying things 'at the limit' - one difference will possibly be more apparent.

My real pleasure in Flight Sim comes from little hops, circuits and trying altitude records and odd landings - but it's basically for fun and due to the fact that I rarely get time to sit and do even a two hour flight ;-)

I'd far rather have the VC running in unison with 04 and do some proper flights (even if I have to save them continuously) knowing that I (skill allowing) can land without a: nosing in or b: skipping back into the air!! (All of course due to my running 02)

And of course, I can also get started on the Comet and 1-11 :tab:

Jim

due to the fact that I rarely get time to sit and do even a two hour flight

Jim,

Just do what I do - start / taxi / take-off / climb and, once in the cruise and you're set-up nicely, go out for a few hours and then come back and do the descent and landing! I do all my long-hauls like that.

The only prpoblem is that, no mater how I calculate it, I am forever about to land just as the other half produces the evening meal...

Or any one a several dozen other potential interruptions - usuallly at a critical phase of the flight.... :roll: