Classic British Flight Sim

i believe also, DOUGLAS paid roayaties for the ventral stair design used on their DC-9s..

rgds
t.creed

The ventral airstairs were not new having been used on the Martin 202-404

Perhaps they recieved a royaly??

Garry

Talking about the rear, was the Caravelle the first airliner to have rear-mounted engines?

It was I believe !

i believe also, DOUGLAS paid roayaties for the ventral stair design used on their DC-9s

I think they did !

Around 1960 there was also a Technical Co-operation Agreement established between Sud Aviation and Douglas too.

This agreement appointed Douglas as world-wide general sdales and technical agent for the CARAVELLE .... except in western Europe and regions of French political influence, and saw Sud Aviation appointed in a similar capacity in respect of the DC9. This arrangement would also have resulted in CARAVELLE aircraft being produced by Douglas had orders for it exceeded the capacity of Sud Aviation fascilities at Toulouse, France. However .... it soon became very clear that Douglas, who was developing its DC9 at the time, was far more interested in gleaming technical knowledge for the development of its own a rear-engine jetliner than the marketing of CARAVELLE aircraft .... and any agreement between the 2 manufacturers duely lapsed !

In other Franco/American developments around this same period the prospective CARAVELLE 7 was conceived .... a version to be powered by GE CJ805 23-B, -C, and -D class fanet engines (same as used on CV990). A single CARAVELLE 3 was ordered by General Electric for this self funded development project then delivered to GE at Cincinatti on July 25th 1960 (N420GE, c/n # 43, "Santa Maria") for conversion and a US demonstration tour. This aircraft was apparently unoficially designated CARAVELLE 7A.

What would have become the definitive CARAVELLE 7A version was a modified design featuring a larger wing, increased payload/range capabilities, and was to be powered by GE fanjet engines with less noise. Yet another prospective version .... designated CARAVELLE 7AN .... featured a modest fuselage stretch, larger tail, modified horizontal stabilizers, wings of increased sweep, and was also to be powered by GE fanjet engines.

Douglas were also to have manufactured engine nacelle for the GE engines as part of its agreement with Sud Aviation.

According to my notes .... apart from the re-engining of a single CARAVELLE 3 with GE powerplants, neither the prospective CARAVELLE 7 project nor any other GE re-enginning came to fruition, due to Sud Aviation reluctance at this time to fund development and certification of the CARAVELLE 7 project (they were content with the RR Avon turbojet) .... along with lapsing of the original Sud Aviation/Douglas agreement .... as well as other reasons too !

Much later the CARAVELLE was develped with P&W JT8D series fanjet engines .... and marketed as CARAVELLE SUPER 10, 11, and 12 models which were very successful aircraft among many airlines of the world until at least the very late 1980's .... and possibly a wee bit later than that too.

Mark C :flying:
AKL/NZ & BOG/CO

As an Adjunct to the Douglas/SudAviation Feud"

Midwest Air charter/ Airborne operated half a dozen VIRs until the late 80s - as I have said one came to grief off the end
of the runway at Altanta and became the fire departments toy -- They were replaced with --- DC9s which Airborne
still operate today

Leif

The first CARAVELLE I ever saw was at NZAA .... F-GEPC, a SUPER 12 aircraft (leased from CORSE AIR I believe) which was operated by AIR CALEDONIE INTERNATIONAL (now AIR CALIN) when they first commenced services to AKL on November 1st 1987. It was eventually replaced with a B737-300 during mid 1989. It was sad to see the old girl go though, but, that's progress I guess .... inevitable of course ! :-(

The last CARAVELLE I ever saw were the SUPER 12 freighters operated by LINEAS AEEREAS SURAMERICANAS until around early 2001. LAS operated a couple of these out of Bogota DC, Colombia, and whilst I was there that year they actually "PARKED" (pranged) one of them on the side of a hill one evening up in northern Colombia with predictably disasterous consequences for both the aircraft and its crew .... CARAVELLE aircraft don't make good bulldozers ! :o

Quite a number of CARAVELLE aircraft have been operated by airlines within the Republic of Colombia. There's some great potential repaint subjects for these once the correct AFG models are all released .... and I know just the man to do it too

Mark C :flying:
AKL/NZ & BOG/CO

For those interested .... the following new AFG CARAVELLE textures appear to be downloadable from FLIGHTSIM.COM ....

Subjects & Filenames as follows :-

Tunis Air Caravelle 3 = afgc3tna.zip
Royal Air Maroc Caravelle 3 = afgc3ram.zip
Fench Air Force Caravelle 3 = afgc3faf.zip
Air France (2nd AF texture F-BHRE) Caravelle 3 = afgc3af2.zip
Air Charter International Caravelle 3 = afgc3aci.zip

Again these files are quite large but represent complete packages featuring Model, Panel, Sound, and Texture.

Mark C :flying:
AKL/NZ & BOG/CO

I downloaded it and gave it a try last night. It looks great but after spending 15 minutes trying to get the engines started I deleted it from my system. I know there are those who want the full, cold and dark start up experience. I unfortunately, am not one of them.

I couldn't get it started either so in the end I loaded another aircrfat started that the switched back

I didn't like the face full of pop ups on loading either :-(

Having said that it is superb modelling and a credit to all concerned

Garry

Garry Russell wrote:I couldn't get it started either

I thought it was only me

Kevin

Re starting the Caravelle there is an easy start panel. See Readme. It is acceessible from the overhead warning lights area. Made life a lot easier for me. Click on the easy start button and make sure electrics & Hydraulics are set to on and it does the rest itself.

Steve M :flying: