Classic British Flight Sim

Well, The DOW isn't what we're looking for, it's more correctly the OEW (Operating Empty Weight) or ZFW.

For those who don't know what OEW is, what we want is the weight of the airplane including but not limited to the following -

Crew and crew bags
Interior Accoutriments (i.e. seats, galleys, lavs, etc) in ready-for-flight condition
Safety Items
All fluids other than fuel (oil, hydrualic fluid, ADI, washer fluid, deicing fluid, etc)
All unusable fuel not calculated in fuel loading

OEW/ZFW you see listed for all modern aircraft and in publications like Jane's All the World's Aircraft is this number. The DOW does not include these items.

David to translate into English for you (from American) its the APS weight
which is specific to each individual aircarft by weighing when that aircrafts
Weight and Balance is done - By the Mr Trott APS/OEW and ZFW are two totally different things. Anyway the only way you could actually do this is by wagging it - because as is plainly obvious no 2 aircraft way the same - I dont care what anyone else says.

What I would suggest is you find the ZFW for a specfic type and I will
be more than happy to run them through the computer at work and give
you APS's for the fleet

for free

promise

Mr Trott Im making this offer to Dave B and the rest of the Ministry
I would be appreciative if you kept you remarks comments and thoughts
to yourself until Im finished

Thank you

DaveB wrote:John..

The more I look into the 'detail' of what is required for Flynet.. the more I find the requirements a little OTT. Perhaps OTT is not the right expression but detail like Dry Operating Weight is a good example. I pulled out the Trident3B FM I have and found there is really no simple answer as what is found in the manual does not always coincide with the model.
I looked further, at Rick's Vanguards this time, and found that whatever the book says is irrelevant if the model isn't consistent. Looking briefly at the 951, 953 and 953c paints available.. they all give the same loading info so.. the logical path is to follow what the models can do and not what the real aircraft did. Not all but a lot of the info you've asked for is available in the fuel/payload and info sections for each of the aircraft listed in your info request

ATB

DaveB :tab:

I see where you're coming from Dave.

Weights for what people think is an identical machine can differ from operator to operator.

Let's put it this way,I'm a paintsprayer by trade and dependent on what finish you want,I know what will weigh more or less.

If I do you a 1 coat 1K chlorinated rubber finish to 250microns DFT using Firvaper 5700,then this will weigh more than a full offshore 3 coat 2K job using Epigrip L425 to 75microns,Epigrip L653 to 125 microns and finally Epigrip M262 to 75microns giving a total of 275 microns WFT finishing at 265microns DFT.
Consequently,if I do you a 3 coat 2K job with a top coat of Resistex C137V2 polyurethane in BS4800 to the same spec(75,125,75microns),then that will be lighter again as poly finishes are not as heavy a paint.

Aircraft tend to be done in polyurethane BS4800 finishes to keep the weight down in the case of civvies and BS381c in the case of RAF,Navy and Army machines.
BS381c tends to be heavier paint due to it's matt finish.

Mark :-({|=

I enjoyed that Mark

ATB

DaveB :tab:

RAF_Quantum wrote:As far as I am aware, most of passeneger Vanguards were all economy - 139 seats ?

When the passenger Vanguards had First Class, it was right at the back, where it waggled a bit sideways...However, the seats were large and very comfortable and the service was excellent...The capacity of the two class Vanguard was 127 seats...I think that might have been the 951.

DaveB wrote:I enjoyed that Mark

ATB

DaveB :tab:

About the only subject where I really know what I'm talking about Dave


Mark :-({|=

petermcleland wrote:

RAF_Quantum wrote:As far as I am aware, most of passeneger Vanguards were all economy - 139 seats ?

When the passenger Vanguards had First Class, it was right at the back, where it waggled a bit sideways...However, the seats were large and very comfortable and the service was excellent...The capacity of the two class Vanguard was 127 seats...I think that might have been the 951.

Nowt like giving the First Class passengers a bit of a waggle sideways!! :k:

It helps the day go by a real treat

Sorry Peter,I just couldn't resist.

Mark :-({|=