RAF Rivet Joint Pic

[Garry Russell]

The RJ was discontinued with a large Flybe order, but there was pressure not to interfere with the Airbus A.318/319.

Likewise the Tay One-Eleven was blocked to protect the 146.

That left the limited appeal Shorts and the ATP, perhaps the biggest mistake the civil industry ever made as that went against requirement from it's conception.

At least other project failed after they were built to the spec which was then changed.

[ChrisHunt]

RJ was killed off mostly because BAe, at the time, wanted out of regional jets to concentrate on the military side. BAe also wanted to reduce the number of sites in the UK so Hatfield (RJ) and Dunsfold (Harrier and Hawk) were sacrificed with the closure of the RJ line and transfer of all military aircraft development and flying to Warton. Later the 125 production at Broughton was sold off to Raytheon. You're right in that the tie in with Airbus had an adverse impact on the RJ but also there was no successor lined up so the decision was made to retire the line early despite orders for the aircraft. Working in BAe MAD (Military Aircraft Division) at the time the issues around the RJ were a little remote but we heard a few years later that BAe management perhaps regretted the decision when orders for all things military went through a bit of a slump.

Regards,
Chris

[Garry Russell]

They did offer to fulfil the Flybe order but BEE declined as it would mean introducing a fleet that could not be expanded and perhaps not supported with later developments and mods.

[Chris Trott]

The sad part of the RJX was that BAe had verbal commitments from all of the US operators of the BAe and ARJ to buy the RJX in at least duplicate numbers to their existing fleets as the gain in efficiency and maintenance was seen as sufficient to justify replacing even their youngest ARJ's (which would've been over 15 years old by the time they were replaced). Air Wisconsin was actually looking to expand their fleet with the purchase of the RJX and there was at least one other United Express partner that was looking to purchase as well (Mesa Air Group).

[TSR2]

That's correct Chris, the main reason RJX was killed was Airbus

[Garry Russell]

Indeed ...as I mentioned above.


British product lines like the 748 and One-Eleven for two, suffered form failure to develop the type at the right time and move with demand.

They actually got that right with the 146 series, but threw it away anyway.

[Chris558]

A shame they didn't proceed with the twin-engine version sooner. But again, competition with Airbus. The 146/RJ was latterly seen as two engines too many, regarding maintenance, etc.

[Garry Russell]

Built for short un prepared strips where four engine safety is paramount, it ended up largely being used in standard routes making the extra engine superfluous.

Similar thing with the One-Eleven where it was built very strong for short hops but ended up being used alongside DC 9, 737 etc. on holiday routes being unfairly criticised for not matching the economics on routes it was not designed for.

Maybe they should have built the smaller Hunting 107 sized version (One-Eleven-100) and developed a larger re engine version as Fokker by building the smaller F-28/F-70 and the larger F-100 proved. All Fokker ever did was build the 'One-Eleven's' BAC failed to.

BAe was prepared not to follow the mistakes of the past with the 146/RJ but closed the shop after throwing the One-Eleven's lifeline (Tay version) back into the stormy waters and left it to drown.

[NigelC]

Arrival at Waddington this morning