Insanely long range flights

[forthbridge]

Hi all,

Can anyone help with technique to improve range on flights/software for range calculation?

As far as I can make out the FS flight planner is useless for long haul lunacy - according to FS9 I would require 4000 gallons more fuel than I have on board the Super 10 to get from EGQL to Wideawake Field, however, I have managed it in flight, (allbeit with under 4000 gallons to spare).

My reason for asking is that according to some sources on the Net, the S10 could do over 6000 miles (with no reserves). I'm trying to figure out a technique to minimise fuel use, and do an EGQL - Falklands non stopper. Probably impossible, but just wondering aloud if anyone has any suggestions?

[DaveB]

I hoped you'd see this one Tonks

I've seen these figures too and to be honest.. they're pie in the sky.. unless of course you take a fleet of tankers with you Consider that a Super could do the LHR-JFK route without a great deal of gas spare and the standards couldn't without a reduced payload.. you're talking, what.. 7.5hrs flight and 2500nm distance (been a long time since I've done that hop so feel free to correct it). You're gonna go further with full fuel and a much reduced payload but how much longer.. well, I wouldn't care to put a distance on it

ATB

DaveB :tab:

[forthbridge]

Well, Just back after an emergency landing.

DMs pop-up checklist is excellent. I managed to get a maximum projected range in the vicinity of 6300 miles - (700 less than needed) - but as I was running at 77% throttle, with 100FPM climb dialled in, as a sneaky way to increase range, I negelected to keep an eye on my altitude, which meant at 16x speed, the '10 stalled somewhere around 48000 ft...... :roll:

Now, while it is ludicrous, *if* I can get a little tailwind and perfect a climb to optimum altitide, I'm hoping I can do this (at least in Flightsim...)

Currently, I had 4890 to go on the GPS with 4010 projected range from DMs popup.

Bit of gliding practice maybe....?

better leave it for now or I'll be up all night at it

[steve p]

The long range Vickers Wellesley might be able to do it in one leg. Probably take a week though... |-)

Best wishes
Steve P

[Hot_Charlie]

Probably take a week though... |-)

...and that's with a tailwind!

[jonesey2k]

In that sim I just use whatever fuel the engines burn per hour times the expected flight time with an extra hour added for reserve.

[MALTBY D]

The 6100nm maximum range for the Super did come with small print.
Still air. No payload at all, Max fuel, Economy cruise. And once it gets to 6100nm it's out of fuel.
So it is a pretty useless flight, but may well have been possible.

Just taking a look at our VA stats, 360 Super VC10 flights - Average Fuel Flow = 5948 kg/h
Given that this will improve the further you go. Say you get 5800 kg/h over 6100 nm, starting with 70000 kg of fuel.
70000 / 5800 = 12 hours flying. So you'd need to average 6100 / 12 = 508 kt.
So average around 500 kt at 5800 kg/h and you should be ok. Good luck.
Please excuse if the maths is crap.

To get longer range, don't mess about creeping the altitude up, get up to cruise height quickly.
Initial crusie may only be around 31000 ft, don't worry about it. Burn some fuel & then go higher.
And I'd guess Mach 0.82 cruise would get you further. :think:

DM

[forthbridge]

Cheers Guys!

I might have another bash tomorrow - I wonder if the fully loaded S10 will get airborne on the crosswind runway at Leuchars....?

Maybe if I shatter a few windows in St Andrews.....

I see your points on the climb and cruise David, as well as Jonesy's rather sensible calculations...

My problems will be: getting the optimum climb to altitude, and getting the step-ups right :roll:

Obviously even the theory in the maximum range is just that (Vickers haven't flown the machine until it ran dry....)

....but from what I've tried, this version is extremely close in capability to what the real life stats say in terms of range, so it will be fun trying.

An optimal descent rate is needed as well of course, so possibly a few flights tomorrow over the North sea at low fuel to see what speed/fuel flow I can get while keeping as much altitide as I can. Im not sure what the 10's glide ratio is - maybe 7-1?

[Hot_Charlie]

An optimal descent rate is needed as well of course, so possibly a few flights tomorrow over the North sea at low fuel to see what speed/fuel flow I can get while keeping as much altitide as I can. Im not sure what the 10's glide ratio is - maybe 7-1?

I'm not sure anyone's ever tried (intentionally) to find out! It's certainly less than 11-1.

[skeating]

I've seen these figures too and to be honest.. they're pie in the sky.. unless of course you take a fleet of tankers with you Consider that a Super could do the LHR-JFK route without a great deal of gas spare and the standards couldn't without a reduced payload.. you're talking, what.. 7.5hrs flight and 2500nm distance (been a long time since I've done that hop so feel free to correct it). You're gonna go further with full fuel and a much reduced payload but how much longer.. well, I wouldn't care to put a distance on it

Not sure about trans-Atlantic with the '10 but in 1979 I returned from a holiday in Malawi on the Air Malawi '10, Blantyre to Gatwick direct.
It was scheduled for a tech stop in Nairobi but with a fairly light load and favourable winds it wasn't unusual to do it direct. If remember correctly we reached Flight Level 430 just south of Cairo

Steve

P.S. It would be interesting to see the altitude capabilty charts for the '10 and Super'10